tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9149446.post1779753019790414758..comments2023-10-10T10:34:10.843-06:00Comments on The Nexus of Assholery: Could The West Be Ignoring the Next Major Threat?Patrick Rosshttp://www.blogger.com/profile/04592482865332628189noreply@blogger.comBlogger11125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9149446.post-78008637899485716952008-02-21T23:21:00.000-07:002008-02-21T23:21:00.000-07:00"This is like a conversation with a 5 year old."My..."<I>This is like a conversation with a 5 year old.</I>"<BR/><BR/>My thoughts <I>exactly</I>.Patrick Rosshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04592482865332628189noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9149446.post-81475588138763669062008-02-21T20:52:00.000-07:002008-02-21T20:52:00.000-07:00"Putin is really not much of a threat to the West ...<EM>"Putin is really not much of a threat to the West per se -- but he is a threat to global peace and stability"</EM><BR/><BR/>Patric Ross is not a terrorist <EM>per se</EM> but he is a threat to global peace and stability.<BR/><BR/>Why???.....<BR/><BR/>Duh...because I say so, that's why.<BR/> <BR/><EM>...and that's precisely the point!</EM><BR/><BR/>C'mon, Patrick, help me out here. This is like a conversation with a 5 year old.kenjhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13269199686855103245noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9149446.post-89294674412171706272008-02-21T19:48:00.000-07:002008-02-21T19:48:00.000-07:00The US has ripped up the Middle East, there's a mi...The US has ripped up the Middle East, there's a million innocent people dead and you're telling me Putin is <EM>a threat to global peace and stability</EM>. Gimmee a break! At what point does reality kick in? Or are you required to carry around these silly views as part of some oddball religion?<BR/><BR/>A million dead due to Bush! And you hyperventilate about Putin. Total garbage.kenjhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13269199686855103245noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9149446.post-40851331532174287492008-02-21T13:46:00.000-07:002008-02-21T13:46:00.000-07:00No, I think you still aren't getting it. Putin is ...No, I think you still aren't getting it. Putin is really not much of a threat to the West <I>per se</I> -- but he <I>is</I> a threat to global peace and stability, regardless of whether or not he sows instability merely in the name of keeping himself in power in Russia or not.<BR/><BR/><I>That's precisely the point</I>.Patrick Rosshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04592482865332628189noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9149446.post-70652754691285587832008-02-20T18:12:00.000-07:002008-02-20T18:12:00.000-07:00That's exactly right. Which is why stories about P...That's exactly right. Which is why stories about Putin being a "a risky global double agent" and a threat to the West are hyped nonsense.kenjhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13269199686855103245noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9149446.post-88625610517599814232008-02-20T11:51:00.000-07:002008-02-20T11:51:00.000-07:00But if he were to do that he would lose the funds ...But if he were to do that he would lose the funds he needs to maintain his regime and his control over the Russian state.Patrick Rosshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04592482865332628189noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9149446.post-89138272048973229052008-02-20T01:35:00.000-07:002008-02-20T01:35:00.000-07:00You say -- It doesn't change the state of the worl...You say -- <EM>It doesn't change the state of the world. It doesn't change the fact that Putin is a risky global double agent who needs to be countered.</EM> <BR/><BR/>...protect from <EM>what</EM>? Invading Poland? He can control Europe any day he wants just by shutting down their gas supply.kenjhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13269199686855103245noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9149446.post-25311038359767641152008-02-20T00:43:00.000-07:002008-02-20T00:43:00.000-07:00Yeah, Hamas was a democratically-elected governmen...Yeah, Hamas was a democratically-elected government that, like Mahmoud Ahmadinejad, wants to destroy Israel, and somehow you think Israel is supposed to just be OK with that.<BR/><BR/>Frankly, both Israel <I>and</I> the Palestinians will be better off with Hamas out of power.<BR/><BR/>And there's nothing silly about pointing out the foolishness of supplying groups you should <I>know</I> you can't control. The United States <I>did</I> help train Osama Bin Laden, for example -- real smart move that was. I won't even begin to defend it.<BR/><BR/>All that can really be said about that is: hindsight is always 20/20. When you lay down with the dogs sometimes you wake up with fleas.<BR/><BR/>It doesn't change the state of the world. It doesn't change the fact that Putin is a risky global double agent who needs to be countered. It doesn't change the fact that Mahmoud Ahmadinejad is, to put it lightly, a complete asshole who talks out of both sides of his face while doing things he <I>knows</I> he isn't supposed to be doing. It doesn't change the fact that the Taliban bombs its own people, even when NATO troops are nowhere to be seen.<BR/><BR/>And you want to lecture <I>me</I> about white hat/black hat analogies? You, who insists that all Republicans are criminals simply by virtue of being Republicans?<BR/><BR/>Good fuckin' grief.Patrick Rosshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04592482865332628189noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9149446.post-51306277181856938952008-02-20T00:33:00.000-07:002008-02-20T00:33:00.000-07:00I am not blind to the domestic criminality of Puti...I am not blind to the domestic criminality of Putin, nor do I endorse it. But the West was quite happy to see Yeltsin's economic meltdown which saw mafia gangs running the country and pensioners starving. Putin put an end to the worst excesses even though it can be clearly acknowledged that he runs his own favored nomenclature. I'm not arguing about Russian domestic politics. I'm concerned about weapons programs and East West relations.<BR/><BR/><EM>And don't even dream about claiming Putin has attempted rapproachment with the West. The issue with Putin is that he's playing both sides of the field -- and in order to do that you have to pretend to play nice with both sides while secretly stabbing them in the back. He's quite astute at it.</EM><BR/><BR/>Baloney. Russia moved conventional forces out of Europe and sought for ABM cutbacks. What do you expect him to do, move to Vladivostok? It's his region, for God's sake! Imagine if Putin was funding "pro democracy" groups in Mexico, Texas or the Marianas. Or siting nuclear missiles in Cuba ostensibly aimed at Guatemala. Do you honestly believe the US would be obliged to sit there and just accept that nonsense. Of course, Putin is a political player! But it's part of <EM>his</EM> region, they are <EM>his</EM> neighbors and he has made verifiable offers to limit weapons systems in the region. Bush <EM>has</EM> sought to confront Russia by positioning missile systems in Europe.<BR/><BR/><EM>And don't even dream about claiming Putin has attempted rapproachment with the West.</EM> -- Your evidence? Or don't you need any? <BR/><BR/><EM>When you fund and supply as many groups as the United States does, it's actually inevitable that those funds and weapons will wind up in the hands of people you don't want them to.</EM> <BR/><BR/>Oh, look, I'm sorry but this is just silly. The MEK, Jundallah and any number of Sunni "terrorist" groups have been specifically funded and armed by the US to achieve particular goals. Pretending those arms fell off the back of a truck or were spirited away from others is just nonsense. The US is arming various terrorist groups within the Middle East. <BR/><BR/><EM>To blame Israel for instability in the Middle East simply reeks of selective moral outrage.</EM> <BR/><BR/>Nowhere did I blame Israel for the "instability in the Middle East". Those are your words. But, certainly the US has acted, with Israel's support in many instances, to support one group over another using arms and terrorist methods.<BR/><BR/><EM>That being said, Israel, unlike states like Syria is at least democratic, and stable, unlike states like Lebanon.</EM> <BR/><BR/>Yep, and Hamas was a democratically elected government until the US and Israel decided they would prefer something else and organized a coup against them, armed 500 Fatah troops, trained them in Egypt and sent them into Gaza -- unless, of course, you believe they walked there on water or mysteriously sneaked their way through Israeli check points?<BR/><BR/>That's what I like about Right wing politics: the Good Guys always wear the white hats and the Bad Guys wear the black. So simple -- and meaningless.kenjhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13269199686855103245noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9149446.post-69902220862064909282008-02-19T23:12:00.000-07:002008-02-19T23:12:00.000-07:00When you fund and supply as many groups as the Uni...When you fund and supply as many groups as the United States does, it's actually inevitable that those funds and weapons will wind up in the hands of people you don't want them to -- this has long been a principle weakness of American foreign policy.<BR/><BR/>That being said, Israel, unlike states like Syria is at least democratic, and stable, unlike states like Lebanon.<BR/><BR/>To blame Israel for instability in the Middle East simply reeks of selective moral outrage. I shouldn't have to explain the implicit virtue of condemning terrorism to you and if I really do, then you're clearly even more hopeless than I thought you are.<BR/><BR/>And don't even dream about claiming Putin has attempted rapproachment with the West. The issue with Putin is that he's playing both sides of the field -- and in order to do that you have to pretend to play nice with both sides while secretly stabbing them in the back. He's quite astute at it.<BR/><BR/>Then again, if you want to sanctify a man who has his political opponents arrested for the <I>grievous crime</I> of holding a political rally, you just go ahead and do that. (Who's next? Fidel Castro? Wait... maybe I'd better not ask that question.)Patrick Rosshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04592482865332628189noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9149446.post-8905255006260911612008-02-19T23:01:00.000-07:002008-02-19T23:01:00.000-07:00There are criticisms that can be brought against P...There are criticisms that can be brought against Putin but Kasparov is hyping features of Russian politics to suit his own political ends. <BR/><BR/>First, let's get rid of the "Russia is arming Helzbollah etc" meme. They are, but the US is openly funding terrorist groups the <A HREF="http://harpers.org/archive/2007/04/sb-tangled-webs-238482832939 " REL="nofollow">MEK</A>, <A HREF="http://www.antiwar.com/justin/?articleid=10558" REL="nofollow">Jundallah</A> and <A HREF="http://www.democracynow.org/2007/2/28/investigative_reporter_seymour_hersh_us_indirectly" REL="nofollow">Sunni groups</A> linked to al Qaeda. Not to mention their funding for "democracy groups" in former Russian states fully intended as an invasion of Russia's political sphere of influence. And we won't even mention the US backed coup against <A HREF="http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/article17906.htm" REL="nofollow">Hamas</A> or the endless funding for Israel. So please, spare us the selective moral outrage.<BR/><BR/>The truth is that Putin has tried rapproachment with the West. This is from an hour and a half press conference <A HREF="http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/article17855.htm" REL="nofollow">Putin</A> gave before a large media contingent in June 2007 which, except for a brief comment in the Washington Post, remained <STRONG>unreported</STRONG> by the US media. It was discussed by <A HREF="http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/article17856.htm" REL="nofollow">Mike Whitney</A>:<BR/><BR/><EM>Today we are witnessing an almost uncontained hyper use of force – military force – in international relations, force that is plunging the world into an abyss of permanent conflicts.<BR/><BR/>We are seeing a greater and greater disdain for the basic principles of international law. And independent legal norms are, as a matter of fact, coming increasingly closer to one state’s legal system. One state and, of course, first and foremost the United States, has overstepped its national borders in every way. This is visible in the economic, political, cultural and educational policies it imposes on other nations. Well, who likes this? Who is happy about this?<BR/><BR/>In international relations we increasingly see the desire to resolve a given question according to so-called issues of political expediency, based on the current political climate. And of course this is extremely dangerous. It results in the fact that no one feels safe. I want to emphasise this – no one feels safe! Because no one can feel that international law is like a stone wall that will protect them. Of course such a policy stimulates an arms race.<BR/><BR/>I am convinced that we have reached that decisive moment when we must seriously think about the architecture of global security.</EM><BR/><BR/>He went on...<BR/><BR/><EM>We have removed all of our heavy weapons from the European part of Russia and put them behind the Urals...[and] reduced our Armed Forces by 300,000. We have taken several other steps required by the Adapted Conventional Armed Forces Treaty in Europe (ACAF). But what have we seen in response? Eastern Europe is receiving new weapons, two new military bases are being set up in Romania and in Bulgaria, and there are two new missile launch areas -- a radar in Czech republic and missile systems in Poland. And we are asking ourselves the question: what is going on? Russia is disarming unilaterally. But if we disarm unilaterally then we would like to see our partners be willing to do the same thing in Europe. On the contrary, Europe is being pumped full of new weapons systems. And of course we cannot help but be concerned.</EM><BR/><BR/>On the issue of the failure to limit ABMs Putin had this to say:<BR/><BR/><EM>We did not initiate the withdrawal from the Anti-Ballistic Missile Treaty. But what response did we give when we discussed this issue with our American partners? We said that we do not have the resources and desire to establish such a system. But as professionals we both understand that a missile defense system for one side and no such a system for the other creates an illusion of security and increases the possibility of a nuclear conflict. The defense system WILL DESTROY THE STRATEGIC EQUILIBRIUM IN THE WORLD. In order to restore that balance without setting up a missile defense system we will have to create a system to overcome missile defense, which is what we are doing now.</EM><BR/><BR/>The short version of all this is that the US is positioning missiles in Europe, ostensibly targetting Iran, but in fact targetting Russia. With only an eight minute flight time to downtown Moscow, Russia has every right to demand that the US get the hell out of the region and its face. The US is destabilising Western-Russian relations by its foreign policy programs. <BR/><BR/>I strongly invite people to read both Putin's comments and Whitney's analysis. Putin had the last laugh at the conference when asked about "democracy":<BR/><BR/><EM>Am I a 'pure democrat'? (laughs) Of course I am, absolutely. The problem is that I'm all alone---the only one of my kind in the whole wide world. Just look at what's happening in North America, it's simply awful---torture, homeless people, Guantanamo, people detained without trial and investigation. Just look at what's happening in Europe---harsh treatment of demonstrators, rubber bullets and tear gas used first in one capital then in another, demonstrators killed on the streets….. I have no one to talk to since Mahatma Gandhi died.</EM>kenjhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13269199686855103245noreply@blogger.com